removing grip

joe padilla · Joined: 16 Oct 2001 Posts: 101

ok i've seen the threads to tighten up the rear of the kart, now i need ideas on how to loosen up the rear- i've already got small hubs on the rear no side bar or rear bar and the third bearing support taken out, by the way im in the supersportsman class with YDS tires, and i wanted to know how wide in the front is to wide, i have a TONYKART ESPIRIT
any thoughts on seat struts would be great also- leave them or loose them, joe

Pete Ryan · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2001 7:22 pm Post subject: removing grip

i am pretty sure that if you drop the rear axel it will get rid of some rear bite

John Denman · Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2001 8:14 pm Post subject: removing grip

If you are running cast aluminum wheels try some Douglas or Lansing wheels. They flex more and take some bite out.

E EJeffries · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 4:13 am Post subject: removing grip

Pete,

I think you'd want to raise the axle (i.e., lower the chassis) to remove grip. To remove or add front grip, the same thing can be done by adjusting the spindle height.

Lower the chassis = less grip (the inverse also holds true)

Moreover, seat placement can affect grip. The same logic applies (lower the seat = less grip).

Eric

Mark Dismore Jr · Advertiser Joined: 21 Jul 2001 Posts: 1097

quote:
Originally posted by speedmodel:
Pete,

I think you'd want to raise the axle (i.e., lower the chassis) to remove grip. To remove or add front grip, the same thing can be done by adjusting the spindle height.

Lower the chassis = less grip (the inverse also holds true)

Moreover, seat placement can affect grip. The same logic applies (lower the seat = less grip).

Eric

You'd think lowering the axle would increase grip by raising the chassis but it just isn't true. You also pick up a push by raising the front of the kart (loweing the spindles).

Mark

E EJeffries · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 8:43 am Post subject: removing grip

Mark,

As to not get Joe confused on the issue, I believe you and I are saying the same thing about the relationship between the chassis and axle height and their relative affect on grip.

Eric

Pete Ryan · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 10:19 am Post subject: removing grip

thats how i thought it was but my dad said lowering it would remove the grip so i just listened to what he said

E EJeffries · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 12:34 pm Post subject: removing grip

lower chassis = less grip

Eric

Mark Dismore Jr · Advertiser Joined: 21 Jul 2001 Posts: 1097

quote:
Originally posted by speedmodel:
lower chassis = less grip

Eric

higher rear of chassis = less grip

higher front of chassis = less grip

Mark Dismore Jr · Advertiser Joined: 21 Jul 2001 Posts: 1097

If you raise the ride height you loose grip, I have tested it and I know what it does. This is what I found and that's what I believe.

Paul Kish · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 2:42 pm Post subject: removing grip

Eric

I think it's as easy as raise the back up and you are moving some of the weight forward. Less weight on the back and you have less grip at the back. Same for the front. Move it up and you make the front have a little less weight. So you also have a little less grip.

Hope I got that right.

As long as you add weight to the tire and you are not doing something else in the process that ends up reducing grip, you will increase grip. Reduce weight from a tire and you will in general reduce grip.

Different tires though have different grip limits and charateristics on different track surfaces. As long as any weight addition to any tire does not cause the grip capabilities of a tire to be exceeded you will get more grip because as hard as you push the tire down into the track with weight the harder the track will push back. The rest is just how you make the weight push down on the track so that you can alter the way the track pushes back on the tire.

Keith Archambeau · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 2:55 pm Post subject: removing grip

joe p. (original poster) I bet your really confused now! speedmodel is correct.
May try moving seat forward.
Softer axel
Remove seat struts
What your looking for with a wide front is more front grip at corner exit.
RACE!

E EJeffries · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 5:10 pm Post subject: removing grip

Joe,

There you go, a unanimous, concise answer from everyone!

Dis and I have differing opinions based upon our own experience, but, as I inferred from Paul's comment, it may indeed be due to other varibles such as chassis design, tires, etcetera. In other words, there might be two right answers.

I'd suggest trying a few of the ideas mentioned and see if you find any improvement. Try only one change at a time so you can measure the impact.

Good luck,

Eric

Pete Ryan · Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2001 5:11 pm Post subject: removing grip

so my dad was right and i was wrong

Mark Dismore Jr · Advertiser Joined: 21 Jul 2001 Posts: 1097

All I know is what I've found in testing. Whether or not everyone agrees. When I made the changes the kart did what I said above. I know because I moved the parts and it was my butt in the seat.