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Jason Vehige
Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 282
Location: United States, Tennessee, Nashville
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 Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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Double Post.... 
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Jason Vehige
08 Gillard Charlotte / SGM sl204
05 Vanspeed Sirio / SGM sl204 |
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Vic Madrid
Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 192
Location: United States, Maryland, Catonsville
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Tim Walsh wrote: | Looks like it is just a 2005 piston to me based on the 0.040" piston height. What I could really use is someone to make an accurate measurement of the pin height on the '99 CR piston and compare it to an RS or '05 CR piston. This would confirm my RS to CR piston swap.
Christian,
Does it look like this?
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I posted this pic in that other thread, please note that I made a labeling error in the RS measurement, it's 21.85mm, not 21.7mm. I'd hate for you to buy the wrong thickness gasket(s) if I didn't point this out. Good luck!
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- Vic
- SCCA/WDCR F125 #54
- 2006 Tony//Kart Krypton 125 |
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Tim Walsh
Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 64
Location: United States, North Carolina, Winston-Salem
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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Vic,
I really appreciate that, I might have gotten lucky and bought enough extra gaskets to create the right squish, but only if I got lucky. Now if I can figure out the proper CCV I should be set to getting back at least some of the lost power, even if it's not a $6K worth of power.
Is there an "RS profile" to the head vs. stock?
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2002 Birel CR32V/ StockMoto w/PI |
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Christian Hubbell
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
Location: United States, Michigan, Waterford
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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Yep my piston looks like that, part# 13110-ksr-730. I guess it's a nice alternative to using a whole bunch of spacers or gaskets with the RS. Hard drive still hosed.... Looking for the same model number so I can swap electronics, good times  |
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Jim McMahon
Joined: 07 Apr 2007
Posts: 2688
Location: United States, St. Paul,
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| Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Christian Hubbell wrote: | | Hard drive still hosed.... Looking for the same model number so I can swap electronics, good times |
Make sure the logic board is the EXACT same firmware rev or you might end up worse!
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Live in the midwest and have a TaG, Shifter, KPV, KT100, Animal\LO206, enduro or superkart?
Click here to join the karting festival at Blackhawk, IL June 1st-2nd. |
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Tim Walsh
Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 64
Location: United States, North Carolina, Winston-Salem
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| Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:13 am Post subject: |
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| Christian Hubbell wrote: | | Yep my piston looks like that, part# 13110-ksr-730. I guess it's a nice alternative to using a whole bunch of spacers or gaskets with the RS. Hard drive still hosed.... Looking for the same model number so I can swap electronics, good times |
What's the HD doing?
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2002 Birel CR32V/ StockMoto w/PI |
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Christian Hubbell
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
Location: United States, Michigan, Waterford
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:13 am Post subject: |
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BIOS says capacity is 0MB. It's a Seagate so I tried to run the Seatools bootdisk but it can not communicate with it. I'm hoping that it's just a bad board which is easy to replace and the most likely cause but finding that exact model num/part is the pain. Soooo......
If you know anyone with a Seagate ST9320423AS PN: 9HV14E-285 and FW: 0002SDM1 Let me know  |
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Tom Reynolds
Joined: 08 Jul 2008
Posts: 555
Location: United States, New Mexico, Albuquerque
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| Posted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Ironically I think that's what I put in my old Macbook unibody. I see them for sale at newegg just not sure about the firmware rev. |
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Tim Walsh
Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 64
Location: United States, North Carolina, Winston-Salem
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| Posted: Sun Dec 18, 2011 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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The plot thickens even more. I've pulled the head and cylinder off and I'm not sure what to think of it. Everything looks to be in good shape, but there are irregularities. For instance I would have expected some porting on the power valve plugs and it looks like the port walls haven't been touched by a grinder at all, they look like rough casting.
http://www.hungoverracing.com/tpwalsh/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=41056
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2002 Birel CR32V/ StockMoto w/PI |
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al nunley
Joined: 13 Nov 2006
Posts: 3038
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 10:34 am Post subject: |
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| Jim McMahon wrote: | | Insufficient squish can cause detonation. Yes, thats right. Too MUCH squish can cause detonation. You want the squish as low as you can get it and it should be set independently of your compression. |
I'm surprised that you say this, really surprised!!
Can I ask where you got this information?
Has anyone checked the compression pressure on this engine? Has anyone checked the CC’s? Has anyone checked the EGT readings? Why are you using 110 octane fuel? Do you know what “octane” means?
Sounds to me like you’re throwing darts in the dark. Is saying that not nice? I don’t intend not to be nice.
Of course I’ve never worked on one of these engines, but basic tuning is basic tuning.
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If the data does not support the theory, get a new theory. (Al Nunley)
All else being equal; Compression is the Holy Grail.
45 years, in and around karting |
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Christian Hubbell
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
Location: United States, Michigan, Waterford
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Tim Walsh wrote: | The plot thickens even more. I've pulled the head and cylinder off and I'm not sure what to think of it. Everything looks to be in good shape, but there are irregularities. For instance I would have expected some porting on the power valve plugs and it looks like the port walls haven't been touched by a grinder at all, they look like rough casting.
http://www.hungoverracing.com/tpwalsh/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=41056 |
Tim a lot can be gained by blending those plugs in, the stock moto guys have to blend them outside of the cylinder which I would recommend to get started. Then you can really sweeten them up in the cylinder, mine are silky smooth.
Edit: Does you ring contact the power valve plugs? It looks that way, if so that's not too good. I'll take a picture of one of the mod cylinders I got with my motor. |
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Christian Hubbell
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
Location: United States, Michigan, Waterford
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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Also, was that a flat top in your motor? Can't tell from the pics too well. Keep in mind that there are different thicknesses of base gaskets so that may have been where your excess squish came from. Get some calipers and measure yours and let me know.
Your cylinder and head look pretty stock too, if they truly are from 1999 they may be more valuable than a nice mod cylinder these days. Look for any porting marks and if not you may consider holding on to those or selling/trading for a mod setup.
If it were me I'd get a dome piston of your choosing, throw it in there with no base gaskets and measure the squish. Then space it up with different sized base gaskets to where you want the squish. Port the exhaust plugs and you'll be rippin'. |
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Tim Walsh
Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 64
Location: United States, North Carolina, Winston-Salem
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Christian Hubbell wrote: | Also, was that a flat top in your motor? Can't tell from the pics too well. Keep in mind that there are different thicknesses of base gaskets so that may have been where your excess squish came from. Get some calipers and measure yours and let me know.
Your cylinder and head look pretty stock too, if they truly are from 1999 they may be more valuable than a nice mod cylinder these days. Look for any porting marks and if not you may consider holding on to those or selling/trading for a mod setup.
If it were me I'd get a dome piston of your choosing, throw it in there with no base gaskets and measure the squish. Then space it up with different sized base gaskets to where you want the squish. Port the exhaust plugs and you'll be rippin'. |
Yep, flat top, stock honda base gasket. I'm pretty sure the cylinder is completely stock since there don't seem to be any tool marks on the exhaust port.
I think you've got my plan of attack, port the plugs, install domed piston, and set the squish. The question is, which dome piston? '05 or RS? Do they have the same dome on them? If not which one would be superior for a stock head?
One other question would be should I hone the cylinder? It has all of 37 minutes of runtime under load.
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Christian Hubbell
Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 236
Location: United States, Michigan, Waterford
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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Don't need to hone, 37 min is nothing. Some may disagree or say "why not" so if you must just don't use a ball hone and either way clean it really really well afterwards.
I would run the 05 piston just because it's available, good and cheap. I really like the Wisco stuff but without modding the cylinder and head to a specific piston the benefits of one vs another aren't going to matter. Plus the cost differece over an RS is literally a set of tires, new tires will make you a whole lot faster than a slightly more domed piston.
CH |
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Tim Walsh
Joined: 12 Sep 2011
Posts: 64
Location: United States, North Carolina, Winston-Salem
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| Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2011 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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uhh.. ya an OEM RS piston was out of the question. The debate is between the Honda 2005 CR and the Wisco RS clone. As far as I can think through it, the pin height doesn't matter much, since squish and port timing will be the same after the base gaskets are set correctly, so the dome will make the real difference.
New tires are on the list along with a bunch of wear parts. Those two bits should go a long way to catching <sarcasm>that uppity Vail kid who keeps dominating PAX/RAW here in NC. </sarcasm>
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