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Enzo Iadevaia
Joined: 14 Aug 2006
Posts: 198
Location: United States, New York, Long Island
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 Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Chris Reinhardt wrote: | | Keith Bridgeman wrote: |
People on here always bring up that SKUSA's switch to ICC in 03 killed shifters. |
Maybe because it's true?  |
That's a load of ****... |
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Brian Degulis
Joined: 13 Aug 2012
Posts: 413
Location: United States, Florida,
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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| joseph hollinger wrote: | | It does not cost $12k to buy a stock moto. And the savings by going to some other motor might (might) be $1k. BFD. |
That might be a BFD to some besides it's BS anyway. We're talking the whole kart and I think that's what your going to spend on a package to compete on a national level plus a whole lot more to keep it going. Craigs list is loaded with decent packages that may or may not be Honda in the $1500 -$3000 range. None of them will be exactly to spec or able to compete on a national level and they certainly won't apeal to the big ego crowd but for the rest of us they're great starter karts.
Brian |
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Russell Stevens
Joined: 15 Oct 2012
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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Amen! for some folks it's about having some fun and driving as fast as your sphincter will tolerate. My best friend races dirtbike hare scrambles (rather sucessfully on the amature Masters level), and his choice of motorcycle is whatever the fastest Kawasaki that is available is when he's ready for replacement. He drove my $3000 TAG and my sons $1500 sealed animal kart. He had more fun on the animal, as he put it "the 4 stroke wasn't trying to kill me". How much you spend is relative to what level you are racing at, and what your end goal is.
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That might be a BFD to some besides it's BS anyway. We're talking the whole kart and I think that's what your going to spend on a package to compete on a national level plus a whole lot more to keep it going. Craigs list is loaded with decent packages that may or may not be Honda in the $1500 -$3000 range. None of them will be exactly to spec or able to compete on a national level and they certainly won't apeal to the big ego crowd but for the rest of us they're great starter karts.
Brian |
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joseph hollinger
Joined: 12 Sep 2002
Posts: 9469
Location: United States, California, san francisco
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Brian Degulis wrote: | | joseph hollinger wrote: | | It does not cost $12k to buy a stock moto. And the savings by going to some other motor might (might) be $1k. BFD. |
That might be a BFD to some besides it's BS anyway. We're talking the whole kart and I think that's what your going to spend on a package to compete on a national level plus a whole lot more to keep it going. Craigs list is loaded with decent packages that may or may not be Honda in the $1500 -$3000 range. None of them will be exactly to spec or able to compete on a national level and they certainly won't apeal to the big ego crowd but for the rest of us they're great starter karts.
Brian |
A $1500 shifter is a pile.
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A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. -- Winston Churchill. |
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Chris Reinhardt
Joined: 29 Aug 2002
Posts: 2920
Location: United States, New York, Ossining
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Enzo Iadevaia wrote: | | Chris Reinhardt wrote: | | Keith Bridgeman wrote: |
People on here always bring up that SKUSA's switch to ICC in 03 killed shifters. |
Maybe because it's true? |
That's a load of ****... |
Ask some of the guys that raced it...
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East Coast Super Kart Series
"This is how we roll!"
www.eastcoastsuperkart.webs.com
CR2 Motorsports
"Home of Cobalt Superkarts"
www.CR2MotorSports.webs.com |
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Russell Stevens
Joined: 15 Oct 2012
Posts: 100
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 3:31 am Post subject: |
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http://www.ekartingnews.com/viewtopic.php?t=120853 Just as a rescent example. There are occasional deals out there that are not "piles" this example is not 125 but it is a shifter and is really rescent.
http://www.extremegokarts.com/crg-road-rebel-stock-moto-pro-race-ready-p-239.html?cPath=2_53 SKUSA legal stock moto shifter, new, RTR, from a dealer, $10,200.
http://italianmotorsusa.com/collections/shifter-karts-15up/products/tag-x30-iame TM TAG shifter new from dealer, $8500 needs $250 in tires.
Point being that you don't need a top level "National Class" kart to have a good time and race at the local or regional level.
To the OP, who appears to have been scared off by this thread - figure out where you would like to race, and at what level you wish to participate. Follow those rules within your budget. I was scouting the local track and getting into the hobby this past summer. Was told that KT100 was the only class for me as nobody is running TAG or shifters. One guy was bringing a TAG to practice days. I found a deal on a Rotax TAG, and started showing up for practice. 4 weeks later we had 5 TAG's running, and by chance some dirt bike guys showed up with a couple of random shifters. We are starting this next season with a 5 kart assorted shifter class, and an 8 kart assorted TAG field. There are 2 karts between the combined groups that cost more than $5000. |
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Tim Pappas
Joined: 25 Jul 2001
Posts: 791
Location: Burkina Faso,
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 6:28 am Post subject: |
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| Chris Reinhardt wrote: | | Enzo Iadevaia wrote: | | Chris Reinhardt wrote: | | Keith Bridgeman wrote: |
People on here always bring up that SKUSA's switch to ICC in 03 killed shifters. |
Maybe because it's true? |
That's a load of ****... |
Ask some of the guys that raced it... |
It was STARS that went ICC first. In '01 there were teams bailing on the SKUSA tour because of the cost and development rate of the motos. And the fact that the Swede was kicking everyones a$$. Most teams/shops were on board for ICC for those reasons. SKUSA followed STARS with ICC so they could keep the racers in their series.
The ICC movement was racer/industry driven, not a choice of the orgs. The leaders of STARS at the time spent a good deal of time talking to the teams and industry people to decide whether to go ICC or moto. Most wanted ICC.
I miss ICC/KZ. They are really cool race engines and not really as expensive as they are made out to be. Stock moto has been good for reviving shifters, but like any spec class there is good cylinders, good carbs, and "good" engines that sell for a premium. Is that really cheaper?
In answer to the OP. Buy a kart you can afford and have fun with it. That's why we all started karting in the first place. Not to bicker on the internet. |
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jim P lewis
Joined: 11 Aug 2008
Posts: 102
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:10 am Post subject: stock Honda |
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Chris wrote -
A gentlemen named JR Clasen got together with someone at Honda parts department and came up with a "kit" motor which is basically a 1999 complete CR125 motor with a 1997 6 speed gearbox, all in pieces.
JR Clasen was also the initial driving force behind the stock Honda class as well. He built me one of the 1st stock Honda engines back in 92.
He was very in tune with the fact that the high cost of Mod motos and ICC engines was going to be the downfall of shifter kart racing in North America.
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Jim Lewis
Vista CA |
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Randy Pierson
Joined: 25 Sep 2006
Posts: 232
Location: United States, Minnesota, Avon
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:39 am Post subject: |
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Tim,
That was probably the most well written and to the point responses I've ever read on this forum. Bravo! 
And I agree, run what you can afford to start with, take care of it and you will have lots of fun. One can always move up. sideways or whatever, so long as they are still karting it is a win. |
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joseph hollinger
Joined: 12 Sep 2002
Posts: 9469
Location: United States, California, san francisco
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:11 am Post subject: |
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| Russell Stevens wrote: |
Point being that you don't need a top level "National Class" kart to have a good time and race at the local or regional level.
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No one ever said that you did. That's a false dichotomy Brian came up with. At the same time, the vast majority of people are going to be far, far better off buying a kart that they know is competitive (as in buying one from someone racing at your club) rather than some craigslist pile. You can do that pretty easily for less than $5k and their are certainly deals to be had for less. Or you can be one of those people that struggles for years because they've got some hobbled together kart with a motor that virtually no one races, that no one could drive fast and which the buyer couldn't wait to get rid of.
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A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. -- Winston Churchill. |
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Chris Reinhardt
Joined: 29 Aug 2002
Posts: 2920
Location: United States, New York, Ossining
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| joseph hollinger wrote: | | At the same time, the vast majority of people are going to be far, far better off buying a kart that they know is competitive (as in buying one from someone racing at your club) rather than some craigslist pile. |
No truer words have ever been spoken!!!! New (most) people don't realize how far off a straight chassis can be. Buying a several year old chassis that's run up front from somebody you know is worth hours and hours of trial and error trying to get it right.
CR
_________________
East Coast Super Kart Series
"This is how we roll!"
www.eastcoastsuperkart.webs.com
CR2 Motorsports
"Home of Cobalt Superkarts"
www.CR2MotorSports.webs.com |
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Brian Degulis
Joined: 13 Aug 2012
Posts: 413
Location: United States, Florida,
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:07 am Post subject: |
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Here's one of those $1500 "piles" from craigslist 5 races second third and one win. Both my sons are running $800 box stock "piles" from craigslist the older won the first race he ran. Boy we must be doing something wrong.
Brian |
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joseph hollinger
Joined: 12 Sep 2002
Posts: 9469
Location: United States, California, san francisco
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:43 am Post subject: |
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Pretty sure you've got more into that than $1500.
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A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. -- Winston Churchill. |
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Brian Degulis
Joined: 13 Aug 2012
Posts: 413
Location: United States, Florida,
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:20 am Post subject: |
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This is where your dichotomy is all wrong. You think non Honda is junk and in fact the oposite is true. It's harder to sell a non Honda shifter so karts in very good condition come up at very low prices. Around here they're welcome to race with moto and ICC and many are competitve and that's the whole point. A newcomer can get into something in good shape for cheap money because it's not the standard set up and these karts make a great starting point.
Here's another up for sale
http://ocala.craigslist.org/mcy/3534333670.html
Brian |
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joseph hollinger
Joined: 12 Sep 2002
Posts: 9469
Location: United States, California, san francisco
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| Posted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:30 am Post subject: |
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I like the nylon strap holding the gas tank in place.
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A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on. -- Winston Churchill. |
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