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Frankie Schaffier
Joined: 18 Jul 2001
Posts: 467
Location: United States, Ohio, Fostoria
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 Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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I guess I never took it as an anti WKA series, more so a series that was offering less classes with more track time. I see no harm in using the WKA rule book as a starting point along with their insurance. Does it really matter as long as the races are ran well?
I do find it interesting that the series announcer is Randy Kugler. Not a bad thing, just was a bit surprised.
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Frankie
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Mark Erpelding
Joined: 27 Dec 2007
Posts: 137
Location: United States, Indiana, Ft Wayne
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:10 pm Post subject: us pro kart |
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Using the WKA rule book makes the most sense. Do you want to go by other rules and oblolete all of our existing equipment? Put me in the not catagory!!
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Jason Ewers
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 134
Location: United States, Indiana, indianapolis
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:20 pm Post subject: Wka |
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| A new rule book would be welcomed by me. I believe that something has to be done about the special Yamaha cylinders and 2 k for a Yamaha is just outrageous. Now you have to deal with the leopard issue with skusa not allowing you to cut the cylinders and wka does. |
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TJ Koyen
Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 1413
Location: United States, Wisconsin, Sun Prairie
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:23 pm Post subject: Re: Wka |
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| Jason Ewers wrote: | | A new rule book would be welcomed by me. I believe that something has to be done about the special Yamaha cylinders and 2 k for a Yamaha is just outrageous. Now you have to deal with the leopard issue with skusa not allowing you to cut the cylinders and wka does. |
I've won Yamaha races on engines that definitely weren't $2k. And I run the same Leopard for WKA and SKUSA. I'm part of a very small minority of people who run WKA and SKUSA too.
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Jason Ewers
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 134
Location: United States, Indiana, indianapolis
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:27 pm Post subject: Wka |
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| I bet they weren't national races you won on those motors. |
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TJ Koyen
Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 1413
Location: United States, Wisconsin, Sun Prairie
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:49 pm Post subject: Re: Wka |
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| Jason Ewers wrote: | | I bet they weren't national races you won on those motors. |
http://www.mylaps.com/results/showrun.jsp?id=1388235
I guess I didn't win that many national Yamaha races, or at least I couldn't find them in MyLaps.
Here's one where I didn't win, but I was .6 faster than the field.
http://www.mylaps.com/results/showrun.jsp?id=672306
"Good" engines are worth hundredths. The myth that you need a 2k engine to compete is nonsense. Someone could spend a fraction of that 2k on driving lessons or having a mechanic to help them figure out how to tune their chassis and they could gain exponentially more time on-track.
On-topic:
I think having consistent rules is great. It allows you to just come out and compete and try the series if you want and you aren't required to change a bunch on your setup to adhere to new rules.
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Jason Ewers
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 134
Location: United States, Indiana, indianapolis
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:39 pm Post subject: Shake |
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| Consistent rules would entail running a pipe for Yamaha and weights and age be the same as wka. I don't believe that's what is being done. |
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Tim Koyen
Advertiser
Joined: 26 Nov 2002
Posts: 1556
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Frankie Schaffier wrote: | | I do find it interesting that the series announcer is Randy Kugler. Not a bad thing, just was a bit surprised. |
Randy does a great job announcing. I heard him do a race years ago before I ever started announcing myself and he was very good. Plus he has a great voice for it.
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Tim Koyen
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Joined: 26 Nov 2002
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:55 pm Post subject: Re: Wka |
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| TJ Koyen wrote: | | Jason Ewers wrote: | | I bet they weren't national races you won on those motors. |
http://www.mylaps.com/results/showrun.jsp?id=1388235
I guess I didn't win that many national Yamaha races, or at least I couldn't find them in MyLaps.
Here's one where I didn't win, but I was .6 faster than the field.
http://www.mylaps.com/results/showrun.jsp?id=672306
"Good" engines are worth hundredths. The myth that you need a 2k engine to compete is nonsense. Someone could spend a fraction of that 2k on driving lessons or having a mechanic to help them figure out how to tune their chassis and they could gain exponentially more time.. |
Which is exactly why your Dad/mechanic is the most important factor in winning races. 
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Andy Seesemann
Expert
Joined: 16 Jul 2001
Posts: 3288
Location: United States, California, Fullerton
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:09 pm Post subject: Re: Wka |
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| TJ Koyen wrote: | | Jason Ewers wrote: | | A new rule book would be welcomed by me. I believe that something has to be done about the special Yamaha cylinders and 2 k for a Yamaha is just outrageous. Now you have to deal with the leopard issue with skusa not allowing you to cut the cylinders and wka does. |
I've won Yamaha races on engines that definitely weren't $2k. And I run the same Leopard for WKA and SKUSA. I'm part of a very small minority of people who run WKA and SKUSA too. |
TJ,
Why are the rules always different when people talk about yamahas?
A complete KPV motor is about $2100, $2500 if blueprinted. Leopards are $3000 for a motor thats almost twice the HP, etc.
These motors are complete with carb, clutch, pipe, etc.
A blueprinted legal Yamaha is about $1700, $2000 with exhaust and clutch, yet on these threads, all the KT100 defenders always quote prices without clutches or exhaust to make the Yamaha seem so much cheaper.
Bottom line, a complete Yamaha 15hp can motor is about $2000 complete with carb, clutch and exhaust.
And that's for an off the shelf one.
A
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TJ Koyen
Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 1413
Location: United States, Wisconsin, Sun Prairie
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| Posted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: Wka |
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| Andy Seesemann wrote: | | TJ Koyen wrote: | | Jason Ewers wrote: | | A new rule book would be welcomed by me. I believe that something has to be done about the special Yamaha cylinders and 2 k for a Yamaha is just outrageous. Now you have to deal with the leopard issue with skusa not allowing you to cut the cylinders and wka does. |
I've won Yamaha races on engines that definitely weren't $2k. And I run the same Leopard for WKA and SKUSA. I'm part of a very small minority of people who run WKA and SKUSA too. |
TJ,
Why are the rules always different when people talk about yamahas?
A complete KPV motor is about $2100, $2500 if blueprinted. Leopards are $3000 for a motor thats almost twice the HP, etc.
These motors are complete with carb, clutch, pipe, etc.
A blueprinted legal Yamaha is about $1700, $2000 with exhaust and clutch, yet on these threads, all the KT100 defenders always quote prices without clutches or exhaust to make the Yamaha seem so much cheaper.
Bottom line, a complete Yamaha 15hp can motor is about $2000 complete with carb, clutch and exhaust.
And that's for an off the shelf one.
A |
I'm not a "Yamaha defender". All I said was that when I was racing Yamaha, we never had a 2 grand engine. It's a fact. Maybe in the 2-3 years since I stopped running Yamaha full-time, prices have climbed.
This isn't the Yamaha thread so I'm done posting about it.
Bottom line for me is that I'm totally digging everything this series is offering so far and I'll be at Moorseville to give it a shot rather than nit-picking over the interwebs. Mark is a smart guy, he already runs a great series, and I know this thing is gonna rock. So I'll be there!
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T.J. Koyen
OKTANE VISUAL - Custom Helmet Paint & Graphic Design
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Charlie Curry
Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 57
Location: United States, Illinois, Riverton
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 7:19 am Post subject: |
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The Yamaha engine, the rules packages, and the associated costs are not the issue.
It is those kart shops and individuals who feel the need to exploit the rules and perform modifications to engines that most honest people would not......those are the people that hurt the KT100 Program in the long run.
Whether it is EDM machining of cylinders or "Blueprinting" can mufflers, there will be cheaters in all segments of this sport and life as well.
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Michael Curry
JoeyKarter
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Mike Unger
Joined: 18 Jul 2001
Posts: 308
Location: United States, Ohio,
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:41 am Post subject: |
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The best thing that happened is the people part of the USPKS recognized that if a new set of rules came out it would splinter karting.
A common set of rules is the best thing we can do to make our sport more accessable to everyone.
Can you image if one track uses rule book A and another uses rule book B?
That would be a mess to explain to the new karter.
The people running are smart people and I happy for that. |
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Jason Ewers
Joined: 11 Nov 2001
Posts: 134
Location: United States, Indiana, indianapolis
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:58 am Post subject: B |
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| I agree that 2 rule books would get confusing. Look back just a few years ago with tag USA and wka. Wkas rule book has been used for years and its good just needs to be tweaked. I guess that's why I was hoping that uspks would have done this. As stated in one of the other posts that the sport will always have cheaters ie edmed Yamahas. This could be easily fixed with a simple solution, let the engines builders even out the cylinders and take them to a minimum blowdown. This would eliminate these "special motors". |
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Frankie Schaffier
Joined: 18 Jul 2001
Posts: 467
Location: United States, Ohio, Fostoria
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| Posted: Sat Feb 16, 2013 9:39 am Post subject: Re: B |
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| Jason Ewers wrote: | | This could be easily fixed with a simple solution, let the engines builders even out the cylinders and take them to a minimum blowdown. This would eliminate these "special motors". |
Jason,
No one will disagree with you on this and it has been beaten to death here many many times. But for now, these are the rules we have to work with, good, bad or in-different. Focus should be on set-up, ability and having fun.
The reason for this thread is for info regarding the USPKS, not the issues that have haunted the Yam class for years and years. USPKS has picked a couple tech inspectors that will do their best to keep the Yam's in check.
Not trying to brush you off, just trying to keep this from becoming another muti page yamaha bash fest vs the USPKA info page as it was meant to be.
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Frankie
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Burris Racing www.burrisracing.com
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