Tragic Accident at Summit Point

[Charlie Fox]

I agree with Bernie if your running 2 or 3 classes a weekend that totals about $120 extra for the weekend. I would pay that and I know everyone at summit would have paid the extra money so Ronnie could be still racing with us. If that is all it takes to help with the safety of us racers then that is cheap. I know transporting and setting up these air fences would not be easy but there has to be a way to keep us safe and if that is it then it should be done. It is not like they would have to set them up around the whole track just in the critical corners that could hurt us.

[Martin Secrest]

Speaking just for myself, money is not especially an object when it comes to safe karting. (Some people think nothing of dropping $1200 on a Euro-5 motor, for instance ...) If the WKC were to purchase two crash pillows for Summit Point, with or without the financial participation of the track owner, I would be more than happy to participate in such a one-time expense. We often have some 400 entries PER WEEKEND. How much would that come to, per person? Not much.

As an expectant father, I can say that tragedies such as that of Ronnie Jackson will seriously impact my potential karting participation, much more than would a rate increase for safety modifications.

As per the place and cause of this tragedy, it happened at the end of the longest straightaway at the track, where the speeds are greatest. B-stocks can easily hit 120mph+ there. There is an exit/runoff road at turn-in, but it's not long enough to save a kart out of control, nor are there any safety obstructions on it. Ronnie's kart was folded up so badly after the accident, track officials wouldn't even uncover it when they picked it up.

God bless him.

[ July 25, 2001: Message edited by: Martin Secrest ]

[Charlie Fox]

Martin, I agree maybe we should start a fund for air fences as this org. did http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/index.html they have collect over $100,000 and now they have ama using the air fences at Races. Why can't the Karting community do the same and force WKA to use them. I know I would put up my $100 for it.

[Erik Frank]

quote:

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Originally posted by Charlie Fox:
Martin, I agree maybe we should start a fund for air fences as this org. did http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/index.html they have collect over $100,000 and now they have ama using the air fences at Races. Why can't the Karting community do the same and force WKA to use them. I know I would put up my $100 for it.

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To clarify a post I made earlier, I would most certainly be all for contributing dollars towards safety devices. However, I think the logistics are quite involved, and I would want to ensure that the money is well spent and that the devices are properly deployed, etc.

I think such a fundraising effort, in principle, is an excllent idea. I would happily contribute as well. After all, its my butt out there!


-erik

[Bernie Schatz]

When I posted my message concerning higher entry fees I knew it would raise a bit of a fuss. I understand that raising entry fees does not in and of itself increase safety. The extra money has to actually be USED for better safety such as air fences, TRAINED corner workers, etc. It was mentioned that it would cost a fortune for those running 2-3 classes per weekend. I have to ask, doesn't it cost a small fortune to run more than 2 classes per weekend anyway (tires, fuel, engine rebuilds, etc.)? I have heard all these arguements before when I was active in karting from 1978 to 1997 so I guess nothing really ever changes, does it?

[Charlie Fox]

Erik, That is my problem with this. Can we be sure that the money will be used to help with the safety and not go into the pockets of WKA. I think the only way to insure this is to force WKA, IKF into using the safety measures that the racers want and need. Also I didn't think about the insurance fees being cheaper, if they installed something like this. That is one way for wka to justify the cost of the air fences and if they did need to increase the entry fees for a year or so. Once the walls were purchased the cost would not be there and they could lower the fees back down. Of course that would all have to be in a contract that all of us racers of wka would sign and hold them to it.
One thing I like about this type of discussion. We can come up with a lot of good ideas and then present them to the people in charge and let them run with it.

[ July 24, 2001: Message edited by: Charlie Fox ]

[Pete Howarth]

Let me start by giving my condolences to the family.
It’s truly sad to loss a loved one.

So in the spirit of solving the problem, or at least reducing the risk some…


Do we “need” to buy them?
Maybe we could rent them from the AMA or who ever.
I doubt they pack up the air-fences and take them home. My guess is they store them at the track. So if they have them in a shed at Sears Point, then how about renting them for the weekend? We could have a clause in the rental agreement, “you break it, you buy it.” Maybe we could encourage the tracks to purchase the air-fences and they could rent them as part of the facility.

Let them save a couple of lives, while the clubs save up for them. But once we buy them where are we going to store them?….at the tracks

[ July 24, 2001: Message edited by: Pete Howarth ]

[Charlie Fox]

Pete I know that the storage and transportation of the air fences would be a task in it self. You have a great idea maybe someone at WKA could look into this or maybe one of the clubs. Thats whats great about the forums we can come up with different ideas.

[Tom Stephens]

Eric and Charlie, thanks for posting about the Airfence. I was not aware of such a great device. I emailed Airfence with this forum's thread URL and I'm hoping maybe they will pop in on this post. Hopefully a safety barrier such as this that could have saved Ronnie Jackson's life will now help save many others...looks like it already has.
In looking further into http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/index.html at http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/AirFence.asp their site has listed EVERYONE who has contributed to this AirFence fund, even those who contributed $1! I think listing the contributors is a great way for even local clubs to start up such a fund.
Peter, at http://www.airfence.com/html/airFenceBike.html rentals are mentioned.

Tom Stephens
www.kartfinder.com

[Charlie Fox]

Tom let us know about the rentals and I will try to pass the info on to the enduro committee at WKA. Maybe this will be a option that they can look into. I didn't see the rental part.

[Erik Frank]

Storage at the track is a logical (and excellent) idea. But of course, it either requires financial commitment by the tracks themselves, or a *large* capital outlay via the organizations themselves to buy enough airfence needed to be deployed at various racetracks....not practical. Renting makes good sense to me as well.

In my opinion, track safety issues are really issues for every racing organization using a given track be it karts, motorcycles, cars, snowmobiles, or unicycles. Perhaps this discussion can stimulate some cross-talk between karters and other racers.

For what its worth, I believe AMA Pro M/C road racer Larry Pegram has raced a 125cc shifter at Mid-Ohio before. I seem to recall reading this one time back over on TKWS forums. Perhaps he could be contacted to weigh in on the issue.

EDIT: Plus, there is the Waine Rainey/Eddie Lawson M/C-karting connection on the west coast.

-erik

[ July 24, 2001: Message edited by: Erik Frank ]

[Tom Stephens]

Charlie, on the right side of http://www.airfence.com/html/airFenceBike.html there are 3 text boxes and the last sentence of the last box says:
"would prefer to have a rental contract rather than purchasing outright, but still have the safety protection all year round".
I will definitely pass on any info I find out, should Airfence respond to my email.

Tom Stephens
www.kartfinder.com

[scott berkheiser]

Tim,

The initial word I heard was that he lost his brakes.

To All,
I attended Ronnie Jackson's viewing last night and that is something I never want to go thru again. We need to learn from this accident so we can prevent it from happening again. I know the WKC is concerned about safety hopefully the owners of Summit Point are also. I'm sure more will come of this issue but right now everyone is still grieving from the lost of a friend.

Scott

[Charlie Tackett]

That airsystemIIs looked to be the portable version. THe bike and one other looked to be more semi-permanent to be left in place, etc. From going thru the roadracingworld site, My estimate for costs comes out to something around $2700+ per section, which appears to be 3 meters, or roughly 10ft. At $270/ft, it would get very expensive to cover very mush of a track at all. Maybe the Bikewall or IIs systems are lower cost.

[Scott Davis]

The "air bags" like the AMA SuperBikes use at Road America, Mid-Ohio, and other places were said to be of no good for karts. They were going to use them for karts at Mid-Ohio, but Mid-Ohio thought karts would go under them.